New Canoe Plans: Sasquatch 14-30

[oldsparkey]

Bow , left side if you would please , that is where I plan on putting the designers web site ... You know ... w w w. grits are us.

Chuck.
Grits... -----> Geniuses Residing In The South.

 

[Kayak Jack]

Grits... -----> Geniuses Residing In The South.

You misspelled Goats again, Chuck. dang!

 

[JEM]

You know what's really cool? The boat panels, the temp frames and jigs (cut from heavy pine ply) and the overpacked and over-taped box I sent them... all only weigh 24 pounds.

 

[Kayak Jack]

No epoxy & glass, ehh? If I'd of been you, Matt, I'd have sent him some grass madras matting, and told him it was new experimental camo fiberglass. Please try it out and report back?

 

[oldsparkey]

This date will be listed in all the history books ... June 17,2008. 4:10 PM.

The kit for the 14 x30 arrived today and it does not weigh anything , I'm thinking Matt sent me a empty box just to pick on me. There is no way that will make a 14 x 30 canoe. A 14 x 30 inch-er , possibly but not one I can paddle.

Guess I will have to open the box and take a look at the parts in it , then figure out how they go together or hang loose and take life easy till the instructions get here. Matt said he sent them separately for two reasons.
One ... He figured I might not read them
Two.... He wanted to keep the weight of the canoe down when shipping it.

This will be some fun ........ When I get to working on it I will set up a build thread. Sometime :lol:

Chuck.
PS. Matt , if the canoe does not increase in weight , at lease 10 pounds when made , I will have to pack two bags of grits when paddling to make it sit on the water.

 

[Kayak Jack]

Chuck, to make an ironclad of it, use gritz instead of epoxy. Then, you can eat epoxy along with your Viennie snausages, and they'll really stick to your ribs.

 

[oldsparkey]

Chuck, to make an ironclad of it, use gritz instead of epoxy. Then, you can eat epoxy along with your Viennie snausages, and they'll really stick to your ribs.

Jack you need to get one and make it , this way you can be sure there aren't any grits with it. Get off ya buns and get one.

Come on folks ... Don't you think Jack needs to build one , he always needs a new boat and something constructive to do. :lol:

Don't tell me I need to set up a poll to see if he needs to build a canoe , that is as obvious as the nose on his face or the gray in his beard.

Chuck.
PS. Sorry Jack .. That was the grits , eggs , biscuits and sausage gravy with a chunk of sausage on the side , I had and shared with pups this morning that made me say that ..... GOOD IDEA. Jeez looking over at pups .. he agrees with me , you need a new canoe. :lol:

 

[hairymick]

Chuck,

I think you are going to LOVE this boat mate. Is your kit okuome?

If so, I also think you will be very surprised at how much easier it is to put together than the thin stuff (and be still lighter than it.) 8)

I have a couple of others to build first, but have the plans for the 14 - 30 and will be building one shortly. 8)


Oh yeah, C'mon Jack me mate. ya want one of these little beauties, ya know ya do. :twisted:

 

[oldsparkey]

Yep... okuome ( The only one Matt has for his kits ) and 3 mil thick , some light stuff , per my request.
Plan on using the 3.25 tight woven to encapuslating the canoe with.

Drawing on the very little experience I have in making wood boats , when Matt said it might be built at 30 pounds , depending on the builder ... I have to break that 30 pound limit. 29 and 15 ounces will make me smile for a totally functional canoe.

Nuts that is only 2 pounds and one ounce less then a priogue I made at 16 feet and 32 pounds. Plus I have 2 feet less in this boat. :lol: :lol: :lol:

Plus to prove the pirogue was a good one to paddle I did 4 nights threw the Okefenokee Swamp with it .. 5 days of paddling with camping gear.

This build will be some fun.

Chuck

 

[Kayak Jack]

And Chuck won't dare to admit, "Gee, fellas. You've been right all along. This Okoume IS better than the compressed cardboard I've been using." :lol:

 

[oldsparkey]

With kits .. I get what is offered and trust the kit maker , so I don't have to cut the panels out , guess I'm getting lazy like you......

If I was cutting the wood you can bet your candy arse it would of been the $9.95 a sheet Luann and it ain't cardboard. If I could make one from cardboard then I would ... Might be something down the road , they have made paper ones ...... Dang that is wood in a different form but still wood. :lol:

Chuck.

 

[hairymick]

Heya Chuck,

Sneaky buggers I got my last order of 4mm marine ply from snuck in 3 sheets of 3mm gaboon. (okoume) I went to war over it and raised merry hell and they sent a couple more sheets of 4mm stuff. (Pac Maple) A little heavier but very pretty. Can't get okoume here anymore.

I am thinking now, I might just have a use for this thinner stuff too.

Looking forward to your build on this one mate.


C'mon Jack mate, Ya know ya want one. 8)

 

[oldsparkey]

Mick.....

Just remember the wood is the filler and shape maker for the boat , the glass and epoxy is what lets you use the boat out on the water.

Sort of like making a kayak Jack ( bologna ) :lol: sandwich. The meat is nothing more then the filling but the bread is what holds all of it together.

Now some folks have to have the yuppie Bologna at $85.00 a slice while others settle for cheese an ham at $9.95 a slice for both.

It's nothing more then what you like as the filler , when getting a kit , you take what the chief (designer) offers and you put faith in his tastes , when making your own , then you decide.

The thinner wood is a little ( more ) trickier to work with and not as forgiving as the thick stuff. Same thing with the 3.25 tight woven glass but when you get the hang of working with it , anything is possible. That is all I use since I like the results.

Chuck.

 

[Kayak Jack]

Chuckie, Chuckie, Chuckieeeee. You keep making noises about the wood is only the filler. Trying to get us to think that you don't know that the wood is the base of the boat. In fact, it IS a boat without the epoxy and fiberglass. The wood stands alone, all by itself.

Adding epoxy and fiberglass does add strength to an already strong hull. But a plywood hull with nothing more than varnish or paint works well, and has since long before epoxy was ever dreamed of.

It adds sufficient strength that even inferior stuff like luan can be used.

Fess up now that you know that.

 

[jdupre']

Jack, I'll throw my humble opinion in the mix. Don't know a lot about glass and epoxy boats, but I DO know a bit about fiberglass covered wood laminates in a longbow limb. 75% of the stress of the limb is borne by the outer 15% of the limb thickness. My friends and I have built, collectively, about 75 bows of different wood species laminated between fiberglass laminations and have found little difference in the performance of any normal type of wood. One of my buddies said one of his best shooting bows was made with poplar laminations- a very light but not particularly strong wood.

Figuring 15% from the inner and outer side of a typical boat panel doing 75% of the work leads to the conclusion that the fiberglass carries most of the stress and the wood only handles about 25% of the load.

Read about a guy that took this idea to it's logical extreme. He built a Wee Lassie one man canoe that weighed in at a ridiculously low weight of 12 pounds or so. He used balsa wood as hull material.

Joey

 

[JEM]

if you wanted to think it as a composite sandwich, then the glass does act outer skins absorbing tension.

However, unlike a foam-cored hull, the plywood contributes to the stiffness of the composite sandwich and offers puncture and impact resistance.

In the set up we use to build stitch and glue boats, both parts work in tandem.

The species of plywood doesn't matter of much as the quality of the lamination job to make the plywood.

A) Luan or even pine plywood that is properly laminated with even ply thickness and no voids will serve as a good substrate for the fiberglass.

B) Species is important with regard to weight, resin absorption, appearance, bendability, sandability, splinters, and resistance to surface fissures.

I like working with okoume because you get A and B with little-to-no fuss. Other species you have to accept some trade offs or work harder to get both.

It just depends on what the builders desires are.

If you wanted to get the absolute best, then get plywood with the Lloyd's register certification stamp. But also get ready to pay upward of $75 per sheet. You can get BS1088 Okoume without the Lloyd's stamp which is the stuff I build with. I found a void in it once and the company sent me another sheet (which I mentioned already but was worth repeating).

 

[jdupre']

I like working with okoume because you get A and B with little-to-no fuss. Other species you have to accept some trade offs or work harder to get both.

It just depends on what the builders desires are.

I agree. A newbie might not want to risk 3-4 sheets of ply at $75.00 per on his first build. A lower priced ply would still give a very servicable boat. But, I could also see where a better quality ply could make it easier for a newcomer to build with. Easier bending, less voids, better surface finish. Decisions, decisions.

 

[jdupre']

As an interesting (or not ) side note. When considering panel thickness, strength goes up by the cube of the increase. A panel twice as thick is 8 times as strong. That does not take puncture resistance into consideration.

A limb on a 100# longbow is only .150 " thicker than the limb on a 50# bow.

 

[hairymick]

From what I have been able to find out, what we call Gaboon is identical to your Okoume. The BS 1088 means British Standard and the 1088 means that the ply is supposed to have 3 equal laminates of timber. waterproof glue and an "A" grade finish on each side

Having said that, Gaboon/Okoume marine ply is now manufactured allmost exclusively in China and the BS Rating rarely complies with its intended purpose. The BS1088 is now being used more as a sort of brand name by the chinese and the exterior "A" grade laminates are no longer "A" grade in fact. - Unless you get the Lloyds stamped stuff. This is why many of the boat building supply places in Aus are no longer stocking it. Instead, they are leaning towards something called Pacific Maple. I have just taken delivery of 10 sheets of this Pac maple and the finish on both sides is the best I have ever seen. It is a little heavier than the gaboon though. At a guess, I would say it is about 2 - 3 pounds heavier per sheet. I paid AUD $44.00 per sheet for this.

At the same time, I took delivery of another 10 sheets of what my normal ply supplier is now calling Luan - 4mm. It has a veneer on each side with a A finish on one side and a B finish on the other and some sort of stuff in between. It is of similar weight to the Pac maple and while not as good as the gaboon or Pac Maple, I am confident it will build a very nice boat.

I paid AUD $11.00 per sheet for it 8) and originally only bought it to use for temp frames etc.

Here is the kicker, Once the outside of the ply is covered and filled with epoxy resin and cloth if you wish, The rougher the finish in the veneers IE knots - darker patches etc, the prettier the boat is. The outside of the resin and varnish will still come up smooth as glass.

I will be using this stuff on one of the more challenging builds just to see how it goes.

The 5.2mm stuff mentioned here might be a little tricky in tight stem bends.

 

[oldsparkey]

The poor postman , he got a hernia today when delivering the instruction package from Jem Watercraft on how to build the Sasquatch 14-30 Canoe and was really in a lot of pain. Now I know why Matt sent it to me separately and not with the canoe kit. :lol:

OK , so I exaggerated a little ..... The package is really not that large , only about three pages less then a copy of Gone With the Wind.
Browsing threw it I was overwhelmed with all of the information Matt includes , absolutely everything is covered , well almost everything.

I did notice one item that was not covered so I will e-mail Matt about that.

The instruction package has a pull here to open notice ... which works really well to open the instructions.
He forgot the instruction on how to open the kit package with all the panels in it , Do you open the left end or the right end , or just skip that and go straight for the tape in the middle ..... Decisions , Decisions , Decisions. :wink:

Looks like I will have to make an executive decision and go with it .... Ennie , Minnie , Might , Mo , take that knife and open the package here. As soon as I can decide which end to open , looks like I will be building a canoe.

I can see one advantage of a Kit over cutting everything out yourself.... It should not take more then a minute or two to have all the panels (20 of them) and 5 temp frames cut out to be assembled. As soon as I open the box they came in and take them out.

Chuck.
PS. Plus everything ( the wood panels and temp frames) was delivered to my front door.