Newbie With UJ questions

[BlueGill]

Hey from Tallahassee. Thanks for letting me in.

My uncle John pirogue kit is on its way and my glass and epoxy kit from RAKA is ordered. This weekend i'll clean out the garage and build a work table. Meanwhile i have some questions.

I have a 16 foot plastic canoe so i'm looking at making somethig fit for one man paddling and fishing. Is that closer to 12 foot or 14 or...? I'd like the option of standind and poling while sighting for redfish.

What do i make the pole out of? How about bamboo? Not stong enough

I've studied up on scarf joints and various methods. Should i be able to do it with a belt sander?

I sound like such a newbie.

Do fish bite better if ur in a painted or natural wood boat?

Thanks very much in advance. I've read a lot of posts and tried not to ask questions that have been addressed many times before. If i did, well there u go

 

[jdupre']

Welcome, BlueGill. You've made a good design choice for your first boat and RAKA is a great company with great products. Almost guaranteed to come out with a great boat. 14' to 15 1/2' is a good size for the uses you describe. Standup poling might require a larger than standard 24" bottom, though.

Scarf joints are not that hard to get a solid joint, but a little harder to make a pretty joint. A belt sander would be good followed by 80 grit paper on a long sanding board to sweeten it up. Epoxy, wood flour and glass will cover up all kinds of mistakes. ( I've heard that............never made any myself. :lol: )

Pole? .....not too sure. Something light, strong and straight grained. My first instinct is to find a straight sapling, debark it and dry it. Bamboo could work if the wall thickness is thick enough.

Fish DO bite better from a natural wood boat.

Joey

 

[BlueGill]

Thank you.

John

 

[Kayak Jack]

You may consider a long, (10-12 feet?) wooden closet rod from Home Depot/Menard's/etc.? Soak some epoxy into it for added strength; maybe a layer of glass for more strength?

 

[oldsparkey]

You may consider a long, (10-12 feet?) wooden closet rod from Home Depot/Menard's/etc.? Soak some epoxy into it for added strength; maybe a layer of glass for more strength?

Jack beat me to it ... A closet rod works really good and if it is epoxied then it adds to the waterproofing. Some fiberglass around the end in the mud will help to save it or attach a Duck Foot to it.

Can get a foot for it here http://www.mackspw.com/ItemList--Duck-Boat-Poles--m-119

As they say ... Avery; spring-loaded Marsh Foot attachment is ideal for poling through mucky or swampy areas. Self-cleaning feet open when pushing off and close when pulled away from muck. Stainless steel springs offer long life. $9.99

 

[tx river rat]

The marsh foot works great and it will help a lot . When using a pole with out one it can get exciting when the pole buries in the mud and the current is moving the boat, you can go swimming if you hang onto that pole.
Ron

 

[oldsparkey]

Just something I have observed while paddling with some of the guys on the forum.

Several of the guys around here have added a 4th rib to there pirogue and the reason for it was to add more stability to it for standing. They used a 2nd center rib to widen and lengthen the center section of the boat. The boat was divided into 4 sections with the ribs instead of the normal three sections for the ribs.
That 4th ( extra center rib ) rib does widen the center a small amount and just enough for them to stand in the boat with some comfort.

I have not made any of mine that way but the ones I have paddled down rivers with can stand in there boat without any problems. Usually it is for fishing and mostly with a fly rod.

Chuck.

 

[beekeeper]

Welcome, BlueGill.

Fish DO bite better from a natural wood boat.

Joey

But you won't get to fish as much. :wink: You will have to answer a lot of questions about the boat and how you built, it at the landing, breakfast stop, etc., .


beekeeper

 

[BlueGill]

Thanks all. I was considering painting the bottom sky blue and white to fool the fishies into thinking i am just a cloud raining shrimp on them

Maybe they will be more impressed with wood

Thank u for all the ideas. Am busily reading old threads to get more ideas. I cleaned the garage and need to build the work bench quick as the cleaned up area is creating a vacuum in the vortex

 

[BlueGill]

1. I don't have my stuff yet but after stuying what I do have, it seems to me that basically you put the sides together, lay the bottom-to-be on it and trace around it. right? so how do I know I am square and straight and true and symmetrical?

2. When I do the epoxy and glass, how much fumes are there? my garage is attached to the house, will it ill the house with toxic smell? Do I need to prepare to go outside? Will the hot sun make it cure too fast? is this anything to worry about?

3. I like the closet rod idea for a pole. On the other hand I have access to a stand of bamboo so I did some internet searching and found out that if you take a torch to it and cure it, it makes it strong while maintaining pliability. anyone ever hear this, do this?

4. thanks

 

[Kayak Jack]

My experience with bamboo is mainly fishing with a sucker on both ends of the pole. But, if I had access to bamboo, I'd certainly try that first, ...... and second, ...... and third before I got a store bought stick.

 

[oldsparkey]

1. I don't have my stuff yet but after stuying what I do have, it seems to me that basically you put the sides together, lay the bottom-to-be on it and trace around it. right? so how do I know I am square and straight and true and symmetrical?

1. The sides come together , then they are attached to the bow and stern pieces. next is the outside rub rail to help conform the sides and add some strength. Then the ribs and finally the bottom.
( you want the outside rub rail on when the ribs are attached , if you don't and just have the ribs in place and pick it up the sides will bow and there is a good shot at breaking a rib or two on the boat. )

When I attach the bottom I make sure I have a inch or two overlap to play with. After it is attached I trim the excess wood with a pull hand saw.

2. When I do the epoxy and glass, how much fumes are there? my garage is attached to the house, will it ill the house with toxic smell? Do I need to prepare to go outside? Will the hot sun make it cure too fast? is this anything to worry about?

A. I would open the door so there is some ventilation since the epoxy does have a order to it. If you are using acetone to clean things with then you do want the door open and no flames anywhere around the area , Acetone is very smelly and flammable.
B. Heat of any kind will make the epoxy set up quicker since it creates heat to set up. You can mix the epoxy and hardener in a small container but right after it is mixed then transfer it to a wider item so it will not heat up so quick . A disposable paint tray is what I use along with paint rollers for epoxy to spread it. I take a 9 inch rollers and cut it in half giving me two 4 1/2 inch rollers to use. While others just drizzle it out over the glass and then spread it using a ( plastic ) body putty spreader.
C. Get some disposable surgical gloves from Walgreens to wear when working with the epoxy. They come in a box of 50.

3. I like the closet rod idea for a pole. On the other hand I have access to a stand of bamboo so I did some internet searching and found out that if you take a torch to it and cure it, it makes it strong while maintaining pliability. anyone ever hear this, do this?

3. Nothing to lose , try the Bamboo.

 

[gbinga]

I've used West Systems epoxy in my basement, and in an attached garage. There IS a slight odor, but not by any means is it going to stink up the house. It just isn't that strong. Now polyester resin is a whole different story. But epoxy, no big deal. Just open a door like Sparkey said.

I think that if you can get a suitable length of bamboo that is about the diameter of a broomstick, it will actually be stronger than a closet rod, though it might flex a bit more. If you could get it the diameter of a closet rod, then even better. I've made walking staffs out of appx. 1" bamboo, have not bothered torching them, and it is amazing how strong the stuff is for it's weight.

gb

 

[Kayak Jack]

Japanese make scaffolding many stories up of bamboo.

 

[BlueGill]

Well I don't have a lot to report but am excited I have started. I did my scarf joints which I had to redo but turned out ok. I'll end up painting it rather than plain wood because they aren't book matched and pretty like my imagination told me they would be. We'll see after I sand them out and put another layer of epoxy n glass on. I have some color ideas in mind.

This evening I'll attach the stems to the sides. Unfortunately I have a meeting this evening so won't have a lot of time. Am certainly learning and can already see my second boat will be better than the first.

I am still struggling with length. For a one man boat I don't think I need 15 feet, but 12 might be too little to fish from. Then again that's based on my 16 foot plastic canoe with fixed seats. With my pirogue and chair I'll be able to sit anywhere I want to and move forward a little.

I asked about smell of the resin because I have developed a sensitivity to strong noxious fumes. Luckily is not an issue.

I read a post in the curved stem thread about the build being as important or as satisfying as the end product and I certainly appreciate that sentiment. It has been a long while since I have had a project that is just for fun. Not something required or associated with work. this is a good time and a good way to unwind. This forum is helping re-teach me that

I also smoked a chicken, a brisket, a roast and a salmon while puttering in the garage so if anyone wants a sandwich, we're all ready for that this week.

Just a note of thanks for the help so far.

John

 

[Kayak Jack]

John, you have discovered some of the secrets of wooden boats:
They're fun and fulfilling to build.
They're fun and fulfilling to paddle.
They're pretty to look at.
Wooden boats are built by devilishly handsome - though often dysfunctional - guys.
And, single malt is better than blended scotch whiskey.

 

[BlueGill]

I AM having fun, even tearing up a scarf joint to redo it. I didn't want a long boat anyway.
I hope my boat turns out as pretty as I imagine it and as fulfilling to paddle.
definitely yes devilishly dysfunctional and handsome

Single Malt better than blended. Hmmm sounds like a research project of comparative analysis is in order. Let me know when you want to do the next study on that. I'm in!

 

[Kayak Jack]

I AM having fun, even tearing up a scarf joint to redo it. I didn't want a long boat anyway.
I hope my boat turns out as pretty as I imagine it and as fulfilling to paddle.
definitely yes devilishly dysfunctional and handsome

Single Malt better than blended. Hmmm sounds like a research project of comparative analysis is in order. Let me know when you want to do the next study on that. I'm in!

You're gonna fit right in. Nurse Rached will be along soon with our medications.

 

[FlaMike]

Bluegill,

Welcome to it!

Some of the best time I spent making my UJ Pirogue was spent on the phone, talking to UJ, himself. That, as well as emailing even more questions directly to him. But even more good time was spent right here on the Forums, getting as much input as I could from all those who are here to lend both a helping and and moral support when needed.

About that "moral support," you do have to be careful, some of the "morals" might be a little "iffy." :shock:

Go build, learn, and then do it again!

Mike S.
Spring Hill, FL

 

[Kayak Jack]

About that "moral support," you do have to be careful, some of the "morals" might be a little "iffy." :shock:

You have impugned my character! I'm much lower than that.