This is why I build my own (in wood)

[bearridge]

I have had the pleasure of paddling a Coleman (royalex?) 15 footer with a mate down the Mary river a few years ago and it took a lot of hits on rocks and such and stood up very well to it.

Friend Mick,

I paddled down a stretch of the Mississippi River bout 15 years ago with a pal who had a Coleman. It seemed okay til I helped him tote it. Dang it wuz heavy. I dont know what they done ta plastic 'n beyond plastic over the last 25 years, but fer now it looks like Royalex iz the standard....the best trade off tween tuff 'n lite fer whitewater. But that iz why I am so interested in the 29 pounders.....not fer big whitewater, but tuff enuff not ta truble yer mind when ya hear the grind of rocks agin the bottom in movin' water. I also dont wanna worried mind when I reach the take out 'n find a concrete ramp. If the 29 pounder iz that boat, I mite git one. It wont be purty, but I dont need no purty boat.....mite clash with my stylish hats. :mrgreen:

I tole Miz Bear them boats aint gwine ta tote themselves. :wink: Looks like I gotta ta be able ta pick my boats up 'n tote 'em by myownself. Next week I will be pickin' my 55 pound Caption (the little sob) up, puttin' it on top of the pickup 'n takin' it down twice a day....three times the first day if I paddle the first day. I kin handle it on my head, but the trick fer me iz ta git it up there.

regards
bearridge

ps I mite jest wait til Swamprat shows up. :roll:

The clergy believe that any portion of power confided to me will be exerted in opposition to their schemes. And they believe rightly; for I have sworn upon the altar of God eternal hostility against any form of tyranny known to the mind of man. Thomas Jefferson

 

[coogzilla]

Hairy, nice boat. Good on ya.

Coogs

PS/ Looks like it's not "your boat" anymore, Mick.
Robin's aplying the "whats yours is mine rule" (-;

 

[Jimmy W]

Bear
I have paddled one Wenonah canoe, but not an ultralight one. The Ultralight Wenonah Prisms should be great boats, but even Wenonah says "Although our Ultra-light canoes perform brilliantly, whitewater use calls for the greater flexibility of our other methods." and also "Graphite Ultra-light construction saves 3-6 pounds compared to Kevlar Ultra-light, but we recommend it only when the lightest possible weight is crucial, and when high degrees of impact or abrasion resistance are not required." The ultralight boats don't have a gelcoat layer to protect the outer layer of material so kevlar would probably get fuzzy after a scrape or two. Graphite is stiff and light, but not very flexible. If you hit something hard enough to bend it, it will likely crack. I recently saw a Porsche Carrera GT with a carbon fiber body that had hit something. It didn't crumple, it shattered. You can get very light and you can get tuff, but probably not in one boat.

 

[bearridge]

Friend Jimmy,

I figger my Caption will outlast me. I will jest rassle with it when I aim ta paddle fast movin' water with rocks in it. Time dont slow down 'n I figger I will spend more'n more time on flatwater without rocks. That iz my interest in the ultra lite canoe. However, while Mick mite build one jest az lite 'n a heap purtier, I still figger the Wenonnah will still be a bit harder ta bust. [I dont mean carport tuff.....jest typical bangin' round.] :wink:

If I wuz a boat buildin' son of a gun like Mick, I would build a 29 pound, 14 foot canoe with fine lookin' wood grain, but by the time I come out on the other end of the learnin' curve, bought all the stuff it takes ta build boats 'n built my ultra lite boat, I figger it would cost me more'n a Wenonnah. :wink:

regards
bearridge

ps I will keep an eye out fer a new plastic whitewater canoe that weighs less than Royalex. It mite even be out there now. Been too busy ta look around.

It is sobering to reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for independence. Charles A. Beard

 

[tx river rat]

Well I been sitting here reading this and just can't keep my fingers from moving Lol .
I think (I know first mistake) Its all about location and what suites that local and water.
I hate canoes in my local and I have owned a few paddled a few even paddled a wen no na last summer My needs in a boat are not met by one of them. I will give them two things there a pretty shaped carry a lot of weight and if you tie everything in when you roll it you might not be chasing it to much down the river
They catch way to much wind with there higher profile and open top
I aint paddling on my knees I would never get up. being taller sided and taller sterns and bow makes them more unstable with the higher weight
With the same bottom and width as a lower profile boat. Jack got a little taste of the Brazos wind and I have paddled both the yaks and canoes here the yaks are a pleasure and the canoes are a pain .
My boats catch heck I do drag them on concrete ramps hit rocks hang up on rocks drag boat down the bank to the river half loaded drag them up on sand bars and gravel bars so they be tough enough for me.
My T-V weighs 44 lbs rigged ready to go, with no top decks bulkheads
or places to have a built in cooler I bet I can drop the weight of this boat to about 30 lbs it will be tougher than your ultra light are more impact resistant and wear resistant.
Your Rolex is tough, the ultra lights arnt they are made to carry not to trip in so for me they not a good choice Paddle my boats more than I carry them.
Again location location location Come down here and paddle your rolex at the end of the day I will be a long way ahead of you when we hit camp u be tireder than me but you can do it . I come play in the white water with you I may tear a boat up . Just have to own what works for u.
We got you beat bad on a couple things we prettier and have the enjoyment of building these boats custom built to our needs
Ron

 

[john the pom]

G'day Mr bear, pray tell what's your opinion of these things in your not so relaxing and calm water http://www.airkayaks.com/u231.html
I have one of these things and it seems to fit all the things you seem to look for. I find it fun in the sea, and its probly ok drifting along in your kind of waters, but hard work if you actually wanna paddle it anywhere other than with the flow.
P.s and psst Ron I reckon them kinda boats aren't meant to be paddled just washed along with the current and would really only be useful on still water if there were lotsa swift moving rocks.
P.p.s. Just re-read the caption and its says ok on salt water definitely not the case. Unless you first replace the zippertags. Zippers themselves are ok the tags were corroded dust two weeks after using in saltwater.

 

[buckisland1950]

This might fit the bill for some of you. Check it out! http://cgi.ebay.com/22-Ft-Concrete-...ryZ23800QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
Should fall into the 29 catagory, 2900 lbs that is! :lol:

 

[bearridge]

G'day Mr bear, pray tell what's your opinion of these things in your not so relaxing and calm water. I have one of these things and it seems to fit all the things you seem to look for. I find it fun in the sea, and its probly ok drifting along in your kind of waters, but hard work if you actually wanna paddle it anywhere other than with the flow.

Friend John,

I never held a good opinion of Sevylor inflatable boats on whitewater. Our college program had 3-4 inflatables that held up purty good. The Sevylors did not. The good ones (bout a thousand 1985 dollars) done good on whitewater....the bigger stuff. Sevylor mite make 'em better nowadays.

I took one of the inflatables ta the gulf coast once 'n it wuz hard ta paddle in the ocean, but very stable. It wuz heavy on the long tote cross the beach 'n back ta the room.

I dont like ta paddle inflatables on whitewater cuz they caint turn on a dime.....more like a tiny raft floatin' downriver. I dont raft cuz I git bored after 10 minutes. It takes me 30 minutes ta git bored in an inflatable kayak. That iz the reason I got the Ocean Kayak Yahoo. They paddle near bout like a real whitewater kayak, but there aint no room ta tote gear.

I would hate ta paddle an inflatable on a flat, slow movin' river with everbody else in quick movin' canoes 'n kayaks. I reckon ya mite need a extra can of spinach. :wink: If yer by yerownself 'n not in a hurry, it mite do jest fine.....long az ya dont punch a hole in it. :wink:

regards
bearridge

Charlie Allnut: How'd you like it?
Rose Sayer: Like it?
Charlie Allnut: White water rapids!
Rose Sayer: I never dreamed...
Charlie Allnut: I don't blame you for being scared - not one bit. Nobody with good sense ain't scared of white water...
Rose Sayer: I never dreamed that any mere physical experience could be so stimulating!

 

[john the pom]

Thanks for that Bear I use mine mostly as a stable fishing platform. One when I don't intend paddling far. Don't have any whitewater around here so its never really been tested. I know they ain't a touring class thing, I figured that as far as "tough" goes these things ought to be unbeatable. I'd compare it to a football, ya could kick it all day long, as hard as you like and not damage it. Not many boats could take that.
Just for the record I don't spend days (well not many) kicking boats, just to compare it with bouncing off've rocks.

 

[Jimmy W]

According to their website here, in 1998 the concrete canoe team at the University of Alabama at Huntsville built a concrete canoe 23 feet long that weighed 49 pounds. In competition, they decided that it was both too long and too light.

It aint yer father's concrete no more neither. :wink:

Picturs of the boat for sale on Ebay being built here.

 

[bearridge]

Friend John,

I bet ya kin kick that Sevylor all day 'n all the nite....even whack it with a hammer. The way ya aim ta use it, it will likely do okay, but I'd git some 303 Aerospace. Here iz a pichur of the NOC "Duckies" which are the $1000+ models....which gotta take a heap of abuse frum the rental crowd on ice cold water runnin' over some sharp rocks. When ya turn little kids 'n rental Bubbas loose in 'em, they also gotta be purty stable.

http://www.noc.com/Rafting/Ducky

Fer the kinda paddlin' I do, I prefer the Ocean Kayak Yahoo. Ever drove a big machine fer most of a day 'n when time comes ta knock off ya climb down 'n git in a small car? Feels like ridin' a rocket!

http://wapurl.co.uk/?KDXTWKW

They dont make Yahoos no more. Dave went ta 'em cuz the rubber Duckies cost too dang much. He got blems 'n a "college discount". I reckon we had 15 of 'em. Fat boys cracked the bottoms of two on the Nantahala.

Tuff in a boat aint about hard. Tuff means "flex 'n rebound" without crackin'. That Sevylor oughta do that long az ya stay away frum sharp pointy things that go bump in the nite.....'er day.

regards
bearridge

I hate rude behavior in a man. I won't tolerate it. Woodrow Call

 

[bearridge]

It aint yer father's concrete no more neither. :wink:

That boat woulda put a world a hurt on my carport. :wink:

 

[john the pom]

LMAO, Bear that yakoo link opened up a site whose shop is one I pass by every day at work! Dunno if thats one of them "mirror" sites that chooses your nearest supplier but gave me a giggle that someone 10000+ miles away should point that out to me the very shop where the sevylor was bought from.
I didn't personally choose the sevylor. Son bought me it as a gift. I guess he was fed of me complaining about having nowhere to fish. His logic was that it deflates and fits in the boot of my small car.

 

[ancient kayaker]

Here's a picture of Dora:

http://www.boatdesign.net/forums/attach ... 1small.jpg

Marine ply, cdn$100 to build, 22 lb all up including the fancy seat, no glass and very little epoxy (just used for one seam). One advantage of a very light boat is, you can treat it carefully, I just tuck her under me arm.

Dora is fast for her 12 ft length, hard to keep up with even in a longer boat, and tracks like a Ferrari. She is also a chick magnet, but the best part is when a couple of husky young guys came over to relieve the old fart of his admiring circle of young ladies by offering to help me put Dora on top of my van. I just lifted her up with one arm and tossed her on the roof. Damn, but I enjoyed that moment.

 

[hairymick]

G'day AK and welcome to the nuthouse.

That is a fine looking boat. Tis a little similar in hull form to one designed by our Michael Storer (he visits here from time to time) and is a really good bloke. Sort of like an Aussie Matt.

Dontcha just love it, loading and unloading a fine wooden boat by yourself easily and the hulky young bucks struggle to get their big heavy plastic or fibreglass pigs on and off their cars with two of them lifting. 8)

 

[bearridge]

What a stylish seat!

 

[ancient kayaker]

Yeah! It's not nice of me but I love it! and then when we hit the water the young bucks have trouble keeping up; a wood boat just seems to have the legs of a plastic one the same size. The seat, by the way, is red cedar and pine, hinged in the middle, and slides fore-aft, which is nice cos' I can recline it for a mid-cruise kip.