Planning new powered pirogue
- Thread starter tw541
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Mac
Glad you are interested in this project. This type of boat works great in the swamp, but I have not found one available that I liked. The Bobcats are nice boats, but they are heavy enough that you really need a trailer. Also, something's just not right about a metalflake pirogue. I pretty much know what I want to do with the steering and motor speed controls, I just need a boat to put it in. I am looking at a couple of ideas but have not really decided. I will take pictures and document the build on the forum. I am planning on using Teleflex control cables for the steering. I have never seen this done in a boat, but some homebuilt airplanes use them for the flight controls. This is going to be a very well built steering system that I plan to use for many years. I haven't really done anything yet except clean out the garage and build a 16 ft work table. I ordered the plans for the 14' Swamp Girl from JEM and am eagerly awaiting them. I also bought the touring T pirogue plans, but probably will not use them for this electric boat project.
I am ready to get started building, as soon as I decide what to build. Another 6 weeks here and it be over 100 degrees.
Glad you are interested in this project. This type of boat works great in the swamp, but I have not found one available that I liked. The Bobcats are nice boats, but they are heavy enough that you really need a trailer. Also, something's just not right about a metalflake pirogue. I pretty much know what I want to do with the steering and motor speed controls, I just need a boat to put it in. I am looking at a couple of ideas but have not really decided. I will take pictures and document the build on the forum. I am planning on using Teleflex control cables for the steering. I have never seen this done in a boat, but some homebuilt airplanes use them for the flight controls. This is going to be a very well built steering system that I plan to use for many years. I haven't really done anything yet except clean out the garage and build a 16 ft work table. I ordered the plans for the 14' Swamp Girl from JEM and am eagerly awaiting them. I also bought the touring T pirogue plans, but probably will not use them for this electric boat project.
I am ready to get started building, as soon as I decide what to build. Another 6 weeks here and it be over 100 degrees.
Powering a Piro with a trolling motor
Glen-L makes a set of boat plans for an electric canoe called a PowerYak that features a trolling motor that has been mounted inside the boat in a well and the control head removed and adapted to control the boat from the paddler position. Steering is accomplished by pushing the control forward or back. Seems like this setup would work well in many pirogues as well including Uncle John's. Seriously considering building an e-boat myself.
http://www.boatdesigns.com/prodinfo.asp?number=61-507
Glen-L makes a set of boat plans for an electric canoe called a PowerYak that features a trolling motor that has been mounted inside the boat in a well and the control head removed and adapted to control the boat from the paddler position. Steering is accomplished by pushing the control forward or back. Seems like this setup would work well in many pirogues as well including Uncle John's. Seriously considering building an e-boat myself.
http://www.boatdesigns.com/prodinfo.asp?number=61-507
I looked at this boat, but it would be a problem where I would fish because of the fixed position of the motor. Where I fish there is usually quite a bit of moss. I want a boat that I can tilt the motor if needed. I also like to be able to raise the motor up as high as possible in thick stuff. I am planning to make my boat totally controlled with my feet, leaving both hands free for fishing. I considered one of the remote controlled power drive Minn Kota's, but I would have a tough time making myself cut the shaft on a $800.00 motor. The service center that services these motors would not even talk to me about it. I am trying to find someone who knows if one of these composite shafts can be cut without destroying them. They have to cut them at the factory. May not be a problem. I would be more comfortable cutting a metal shaft.
I bought the plans for the Touring-T pirogue and the Swamp Girl from JEM and will build one or both of them, although I am still considering a custom designed boat. I actually have the plywood cut out for the Swamp Girl but I am at a standstill until my epoxy and fiberglass gets here next week.
I bought the plans for the Touring-T pirogue and the Swamp Girl from JEM and will build one or both of them, although I am still considering a custom designed boat. I actually have the plywood cut out for the Swamp Girl but I am at a standstill until my epoxy and fiberglass gets here next week.
The moss would be a problem alright. One solution might be a pedal to raise the motor straight up but that would entail building a boxlike enclosure for the motor to recess into the bottom of the hull when in the raised position.
I notice the Glen L Design only calls for a 30 or 35 lb thrust motor while the endura models are about 40 & up I believe. Those motors start at mostly under 200 dollars which would make it worthwhile maybe to devise a pedal steering system yourself. The lack of a reasonably priced remote for these motors is indeed frustrating. I wonder if a moss resistant cage around the prop would prove practical since you would have an extra 10 lbs of thrust to play with?
I have an endura 40 lb and it pushes along a gamefisher 12 rowboat quite nicely. At the lowest speed it is so quiet I have to look at the wake to tell it is on and on the highest forward speed of 5 I am almost on a plane. With a trimmed 15"7 piro I doubt if you would ever need the highest speed.
I notice the Glen L Design only calls for a 30 or 35 lb thrust motor while the endura models are about 40 & up I believe. Those motors start at mostly under 200 dollars which would make it worthwhile maybe to devise a pedal steering system yourself. The lack of a reasonably priced remote for these motors is indeed frustrating. I wonder if a moss resistant cage around the prop would prove practical since you would have an extra 10 lbs of thrust to play with?
I have an endura 40 lb and it pushes along a gamefisher 12 rowboat quite nicely. At the lowest speed it is so quiet I have to look at the wake to tell it is on and on the highest forward speed of 5 I am almost on a plane. With a trimmed 15"7 piro I doubt if you would ever need the highest speed.
Yeah FB I think I have found my new hobby. I have always had an interest in boats and have owned a few but this is my first foray into building from scratch. These type boats suit me to a T. Quick to build and customize and inexpensive enough to experiment. Not to mention it has this fine group to encourage and educate.
maddog said:Not to mention it has this fine group to encourage and educate.
Are you sure you have said that on the right web site , it has to be a misprint. You have to have us confused with another web site you are with. You know.. the one with sane folks on it. :roll:
Chuck.
My sanity went with my first (and only) wife and best dog, oldsparkey so indeed this is the perfect place for me.
Headed out for a dolphin watching cruise on a sailboat in the Gulf so I will catch you all later.
Headed out for a dolphin watching cruise on a sailboat in the Gulf so I will catch you all later.
Funbun, after considering the matter for a week I have come to the conclusion that a tilt up motor off the the stern would probably work best from the standpoint of maintaining the shallow draft of a pirogue.
It seems to me that shortening a trolling motor is a fairly simple matter in that as near as I can ascertain only two wires run down the shaft to a watertight housing. Carefully cutting the shaft without cutting the wires should not be that difficult and then the shaft could then be reattached with a section removed.
Looking at the Glen L arrangement it seems like it would also make sense to remove the top of the motor with all controls intact and lengthening these wires to allow the control unit to be relocated to a point near the paddler.
Replace the head with a waterproof cover with an arm attached so your rudder control would operate it also from the paddler position.
The last problem would be allowing the motor flip up. Rather than a hard lock I would consider a spring holding the motor in the down position in conjunction with a pedal or lever that would simultaneously withdraw a spring loaded pin and lift the motor. Releasing the pedal or lever would allow the motor to return to the lock down position. If the spring were strong enough it might be possible to forgo the pin locking mechanism. I like the idea of a lever because the lever could be locked in order to hold the motor in the raised position for launching, beaching, etc.
A mockup of all controls would probably be in order before actually cutting into a new trolling motor. There are a number of posts on the internet where people have shortened these motors that might prove helpful.
The result should be a short shaft electric motor, low profile, with all controls at the paddler position.
It seems to me that shortening a trolling motor is a fairly simple matter in that as near as I can ascertain only two wires run down the shaft to a watertight housing. Carefully cutting the shaft without cutting the wires should not be that difficult and then the shaft could then be reattached with a section removed.
Looking at the Glen L arrangement it seems like it would also make sense to remove the top of the motor with all controls intact and lengthening these wires to allow the control unit to be relocated to a point near the paddler.
Replace the head with a waterproof cover with an arm attached so your rudder control would operate it also from the paddler position.
The last problem would be allowing the motor flip up. Rather than a hard lock I would consider a spring holding the motor in the down position in conjunction with a pedal or lever that would simultaneously withdraw a spring loaded pin and lift the motor. Releasing the pedal or lever would allow the motor to return to the lock down position. If the spring were strong enough it might be possible to forgo the pin locking mechanism. I like the idea of a lever because the lever could be locked in order to hold the motor in the raised position for launching, beaching, etc.
A mockup of all controls would probably be in order before actually cutting into a new trolling motor. There are a number of posts on the internet where people have shortened these motors that might prove helpful.
The result should be a short shaft electric motor, low profile, with all controls at the paddler position.
I removed the controller from my MinnKota, cut about a foot off the top of the shaft and shortened the wires to fit. All that was required to put it back together was drilling a new hoe for the bolt holding the controller to the shaft. Works fine.
BEARS BUDDY
Was the motor you shortened a composite shaft? I have cut and shortened a couple of metal shaft motors without problem. All of the newer Minn Kota's are composite shaft. I talked to a guy at a service center who said that all of the composite shafts he had seen cut later split lengthwise. That's a little hard to believe. I think he might be full of something. He wasn't someone I would let work on my motor anyway. I did find on the internet where a guy shortened the shaft on one of the Riptide motors with the white shaft. I am guessing the black shaft motors are similar material. It looked like a really thick wall fiberglass shaft. I am probably going to try this on one of these, since Minn Kota has a pretty good rebate going on these motors now.
Was the motor you shortened a composite shaft? I have cut and shortened a couple of metal shaft motors without problem. All of the newer Minn Kota's are composite shaft. I talked to a guy at a service center who said that all of the composite shafts he had seen cut later split lengthwise. That's a little hard to believe. I think he might be full of something. He wasn't someone I would let work on my motor anyway. I did find on the internet where a guy shortened the shaft on one of the Riptide motors with the white shaft. I am guessing the black shaft motors are similar material. It looked like a really thick wall fiberglass shaft. I am probably going to try this on one of these, since Minn Kota has a pretty good rebate going on these motors now.
I cut one of those shafts once and never had any problems. I used a Reciprocating saw but a miter saw might be better.
TW - I am a brand new b'builder wannabe, so I can't offer the benefit of my vast experience. However, a plan that may fit your needs can be found at gatorboats.com The 'Cajun Skiff' version of their pirogue. Looks great to me. Check out their gallery of customer's projects.
CJ
CJ
tw541 said:BEARS BUDDY
Was the motor you shortened a composite shaft? I have cut and shortened a couple of metal shaft motors without problem. All of the newer Minn Kota's are composite shaft. I talked to a guy at a service center who said that all of the composite shafts he had seen cut later split lengthwise. That's a little hard to believe. I think he might be full of something. He wasn't someone I would let work on my motor anyway. I did find on the internet where a guy shortened the shaft on one of the Riptide motors with the white shaft. I am guessing the black shaft motors are similar material. It looked like a really thick wall fiberglass shaft. I am probably going to try this on one of these, since Minn Kota has a pretty good rebate going on these motors now.
You shouldn't have any splitting with a true composite shaft. I could see that happening with like a PVC shaft.
Only way I could envision that happening is if they used mono-axial fiberglass (fibers only in one direction, no fibers at 90 degress). But that would be just plain silly to make a shaft like that.
been a while since i worked composites but back in the late 80's early 90's things like fishing rods, arrow shafts and bike frames were unidirectional carbon fibers with epoxy resin. The epoxies were thermosets which means they cross-linked for the strength but also made them somewhat brittle and subject to failure and propagation along hairline cracks.
one of my co-workers was bow hunting for deer in about 1985 when his carbon shaft arrow had a catastrophic failure just as he released the bowstring. Thousands of carbon fibers imbeded in the palm of his hand.
don't know much about current day trolling motor shafts, but if it were unidirectional fibers, then a split as described would be possible
one of my co-workers was bow hunting for deer in about 1985 when his carbon shaft arrow had a catastrophic failure just as he released the bowstring. Thousands of carbon fibers imbeded in the palm of his hand.
don't know much about current day trolling motor shafts, but if it were unidirectional fibers, then a split as described would be possible
CJ
I looked at these boats a while back and they have some interesting designs. I think I am going to use a new design for my electric boat project. I'm working on the details now.
Between the Swamp Girl I am about 3/4 of the way through, these two electric pirogues, and the Freedom 15 plans I received yesterday, I will be busy for a while. I haven't even finished the first boat, and I already have firm plans to build at least 3, maybe four more. (If my wife decides she wants a Freedom too.)
I looked at these boats a while back and they have some interesting designs. I think I am going to use a new design for my electric boat project. I'm working on the details now.
Between the Swamp Girl I am about 3/4 of the way through, these two electric pirogues, and the Freedom 15 plans I received yesterday, I will be busy for a while. I haven't even finished the first boat, and I already have firm plans to build at least 3, maybe four more. (If my wife decides she wants a Freedom too.)
Re:
Bob
:How did the boats turn out?tw541 said:CJ
I looked at these boats a while back and they have some interesting designs. I think I am going to use a new design for my electric boat project. I'm working on the details now.
Between the Swamp Girl I am about 3/4 of the way through, these two electric pirogues, and the Freedom 15 plans I received yesterday, I will be busy for a while. I haven't even finished the first boat, and I already have firm plans to build at least 3, maybe four more. (If my wife decides she wants a Freedom too.)
Bob