Chaland #2

[beekeeper]

Started another boat recently. Bad time of the year weather wise. Lots of cold and rain. Even had some of this strange stuff.

Got off to a rocky start when one of my "brilliant" ideas flopped. Cut a 2"X6" to act as a strong back to shape the floor to the rocker I wanted.

Centered the floor on top and clamped the ends down but the floor bowed because the chine logs did not bend the same as the plywood bottom. I think using two runners located near the edges would have worked. I went back to what has worked for me.

 

[Kayak Jack]

JD! What’s that white stuff doing on top of your Looziana Cadillac??!!

I’ve never used a strong back. They look complicated to me. Some temporary bulkheads served the needs. You put a lot into your boats, and get a lot back out.

I’m always impressed by the differences in boat design for your area, and what works up here on inland lakes and rivers. The boats are designed for the situation. But the general job of carrying a paddler and gear remain generally the same.

 

[beekeeper]

That is snow. Not that uncommon here. We get one usually every four or five years.
The strong back is not complicated. Basically a narrow, straight, and level "table" to attach "temporary bulkheads" or other forms to. Not necessary for most builds but helps keeps things aligned and steady.
I don't have enough typing in me to dive very deep in different boat designs, but I should clarify this one. The definition of a Chaland is kind of vague. Best I can determine they were short and rectangular shaped. Almost barge shape, somewhat similar to river punts. It was a very stable boat intended for short trips like crossing the bayou or a work platform near one's house.
This boat will have more rocker like a punt but with some flare to the sides for increased stability. It is more narrower than a punt or Chaland. Boat designs vary greatly under the same name so I'm calling this one a Chaland.

 

[jdupre']

Looks like a good, stable design for short distance fishing trips.

 

[beekeeper]

Built this pirogue in 2019 https://www.southernpaddler.com/community/threads/pirogue-built-from-pattern.10685/ Passed it to my great niece and now the whole family wants to paddle.
This little Chaland will be for the kids (supervised) 7 and 10 yrs. old . It should be large enough for the two of them now but will still work for one when they grow bigger.
They mostly float fish and tube on the Bogue Chitto River in Mississippi. No long distant trips so it should work fine.

 

[beekeeper]

Got both sides and stem pieces installed. Technically it is a boat now, but still needs a lot more work.

Fitted this end board(stern) first. The other end(bow) was suppose to be the same. Tried the board on that end and to my surprise it was an exact fit. I usually get close but usually some fitting is needed.
I think the strong back set up I used this time worked better and helped.

 

[Kayak Jack]

Nice when things work out, ehh.

 

[oldbuffpilot]

OK JD, I still am foggy about how you do this. Tell me if this is right.
1. You bend the bottom to the desired rocker.
2. fasten on the chines, to hold the rocker? Why don't the chines straighten out the rocker? Are the chines cut to an angle? put end boards bow and stern?
3. plane the sides of the chines to the flare angle.
4. fasten sides, stern and bow to shape the boat. Any forms to do this?

Am I even close? I think I'd like to give it a try, built too many stitch and glue for now.
Just look at this as a typing exercise!

Thanks,
Andy

 

[Outdigenous]

OK JD, I still am foggy about how you do this. Tell me if this is right.
1. You bend the bottom to the desired rocker.
2. fasten on the chines, to hold the rocker? Why don't the chines straighten out the rocker? Are the chines cut to an angle? put end boards bow and stern?
3. plane the sides of the chines to the flare angle.
4. fasten sides, stern and bow to shape the boat. Any forms to do this?

Am I even close? I think I'd like to give it a try, built too many stitch and glue for now.
Just look at this as a typing exercise!

Thanks,
Andy

While awaiting beekeeper's answer, may I say if you build a vertical sided box and then force the sides to flair some, you will create some rocker (or either create some broken boards).

 

[beekeeper]

Sorry for the confusion. I will try to write it out in steps. If this does not help I will call you.
1. Use a batten to shape and mark the floor to the desired shape. Cut it out leaving a little material to be planed/sanded flush with the chine logs after they are installed.
2. Cut the chine logs to the amount of the maximum flare you want. This occurs at the point where the maximum beam of the sides is.
3. Attach the logs to the floor and trim the excess floor material flush with the sides of the logs.
4. Place the floor on supports (bottom side up) and bend to the shape/rocker you desire. Supports do not have to be a "strong back" or elaborate just strong enough to maintain the shape and support the remaining work.
5. Temp. clamp/attach the side panels to the floor and along side of the chine logs. Make sure they flare the same as the chine angle. Mark the panels along the bottom and cut off the excess. This will show as an arch cut off the bottom of the sides. On a boat like this Chaland the side angles remain the same from stem to stem. You can then attach the sides and trim them flush with the bottom.
6. On a boat with pointed ends (pirogues) the side flare angle will approach vertical near the ends. The chine logs angles have to match these angles so the sides can come together. If your design has near vertical side flare like only 15 to 20 deg. the sides probably could be tortured together with out any change to the logs angle. My pirogues usually have 30deg. flare at midship. The ends at the stems will be about 5to 10 deg. A rolling bevel will be planed onto the chine logs. I temp attach the sides in the middle and pull them around as i plane the log till the sides fit.

Some pictures. Sorry can't find any showing the actual progressive /rolling bevel.

The last three pictures shows what happens when the logs do not have the progressive bevel. The sides were tortured together and cracked. This how you learn.

 

[oldbuffpilot]

Bee, Thanks for taking the time to post the pics and explanation. I had parts of it in the wrong order. I now see how it works. Now I know how you knew about how much cut back the sides of my water mocassion copy needed. I'm looking forward trying out your method.

Thanks again
Andy

 

[beekeeper]

Purchased a screw eye for the inside of the boat at the stern to attach the tie down rope when transporting the boat in my truck. Front side of package say's "Safe working load 120 lbs". Back side of package reads "Do not use to hang loads, lift loads, or support weights of persons or objects.". Huh?

 

[Kayak Jack]

Legal disclaimer. You know, like when you buy a rescue rope, and the package states, “CAUTION do not use this rope in emergency!”

 

[oldsparkey]

Legal disclaimer. You know, like when you buy a rescue rope, and the package states, “CAUTION do not use this rope in emergency!”

About as brilliant as a cup of coffee to go at McDonald's , CAUTION , Contents are hot.

 

[Kayak Jack]

BINGO!

 

[beekeeper]

After several delays, including another snow/ice event the boat is finished.

 

[oldbuffpilot]

Started another boat recently. Bad time of the year weather wise. Lots of cold and rain. Even had some of this strange stuff.
View attachment 1527
Got off to a rocky start when one of my "brilliant" ideas flopped. Cut a 2"X6" to act as a strong back to shape the floor to the rocker I wanted.
View attachment 1528
Centered the floor on top and clamped the ends down but the floor bowed because the chine logs did not bend the same as the plywood bottom. I think using two runners located near the edges would have worked. I went back to what has worked for me.
View attachment 1529
View attachment 1530

Looks like its hard to beat the water jug rocker. I'm curious where did you learn that trick?

 

[beekeeper]

If you are talking about setting the rocker. The first boat I built was a Gator Boats' skiff. Their build procedure was to install the chine logs to the floor, then support it upside down on 5 gal. buckets. The sides were then attached to the logs. When they were attached to the bottom it bent to the shape of the sides but they were straight edged and induced "lots" of rocker.
Short of a computer program nobody could tell me a formula to use for the side shape to equal a specific amount of rocker. After some failures, my building process has evolved so I can set the rocker to what I want in the bottom and then mark and cut the sides to fit.
The only short coming in doing it this way is the chine logs has to have a progressive bevel to match the vertical angles of the sides. A little harder than the traditional method of attaching them to the sides and just planing level. It is worth it for me to have precision in setting rocker and side flare settings vs "close enough". I suspect with stich and glue building it would even be easier. A couple of jigs (forms) could determine the side flare and act as supports for the bottom.

If you are asking about the use of water jugs for weights, I have no idea where that came from.

 

[oldbuffpilot]

If you are talking about setting the rocker. The first boat I built was a Gator Boats' skiff. Their build procedure was to install the chine logs to the floor, then support it upside down on 5 gal. buckets. The sides were then attached to the logs. When they were attached to the bottom it bent to the shape of the sides but they were straight edged and induced "lots" of rocker.
Short of a computer program nobody could tell me a formula to use for the side shape to equal a specific amount of rocker. After some failures, my building process has evolved so I can set the rocker to what I want in the bottom and then mark and cut the sides to fit.
The only short coming in doing it this way is the chine logs has to have a progressive bevel to match the vertical angles of the sides. A little harder than the traditional method of attaching them to the sides and just planing level. It is worth it for me to have precision in setting rocker and side flare settings vs "close enough". I suspect with stich and glue building it would even be easier. A couple of jigs (forms) could determine the side flare and act as supports for the bottom.

If you are asking about the use of water jugs for weights, I have no idea where that came from.

Thanks, I bought the Gator plans several years ago, but reverted to modifying uncle John types. Somehow before I had missed "mark and cut the sides to fit" makes more sense now! Thanks for relating the idea to stitch and glue. I'll play with it. I still have a 5 lb lift limit, and running a saw is out maybe about 2 weeks.

 

[beekeeper]

Thanks, I bought the Gator plans several years ago, but reverted to modifying uncle John types. Somehow before I had missed "mark and cut the sides to fit" makes more sense now! Thanks for relating the idea to stitch and glue. I'll play with it. I still have a 5 lb lift limit, and running a saw is out maybe about 2 weeks.

Seems "Gator Boats" are no more. I have their Crock (skiff), Bullfrog (strip build), and the john boat plans. If you had their pirogue, and/or the one man sneak boat (Gator) plans I would love to see them. Anybody?