About to glass questions??

[chickenmofo]

My buddy and I are about to glass the boat. It's a Uncle John's kit. We have had a great time so far and will be building another one.

I know this has been covered already but i can't find the thread for it. sorry

We were wondering the steps and materials we will need to glass the boat inside and out.

We are pretty big guys 6' 250lbs

1 What weight cloth and if doubling glass on the bottom would be a good idea

2 A good brand resin and hardener

3 About how much resin and hardener

4 A step-by-step procedure for glassing(saturate, glass, sand ect.)

5 Do you glass over the rub rails for more strength

6 Epoxy or Polyester resin(from what we understand polyester seems better ...and much cheaper... for wooden boat building)

7 What type of paint for what type of resin?


I feel We know about taping the joints on the bottom in the inside and using epoxy and wood dust to fillet the corners and covering with tape about half way up the ribs.

Any input will be appreciated and we will post pics when done!!

 

[JEM]

Uncle J should have that info in his plans. I've only read them a couple times but his plans are pretty thorough. What I say below is GENERAL info. Always default to what Uncle J says for his plans.

1 What weight cloth and if doubling glass on the bottom would be a good idea

6-ounce is the general rule. Stuff is REAL strong. No need to double up even if you weighed 300 each.

2 A good brand resin and hardener

I believe Uncle J has a deal with RAKA. Others are System Three, MAS, Progressive, West.

3 About how much resin and hardener

Instructions should give a Bill of Materials and detail how much.

4 A step-by-step procedure for glassing(saturate, glass, sand ect.)

Instructions should detail that. You can download my free plans for some additional ideas. But default to what Uncle J says for his plans.

5 Do you glass over the rub rails for more strength

You can, but it's not needed.

6 Epoxy or Polyester resin(from what we understand polyester seems better ...and much cheaper... for wooden boat building)

I'm bias and dislike poly. I prefer epoxy but others like poly. Epoxy will provide the best results by far. But it costs a little more.

7 What type of paint for what type of resin?

You could use cheap porch paint or go with a marine LPU paint.

 

[chickenmofo]

Thanks

 

[jimsong]

FYI, Raka doesn't discount for UJ customers, but their prices are among the lowest in the epoxy retailer industry
I will order more stuff from Larry tomorrow, but it kind of peeved me not to get a discount, but, mind you, LARRY didn't tell there was a discount, I just read it over and over on boat building forums.

 

[JEM]

FYI, Raka doesn't discount for UJ customers, but their prices are among the lowest in the epoxy retailer industry
I will order more stuff from Larry tomorrow, but it kind of peeved me not to get a discount, but, mind you, LARRY didn't tell there was a discount, I just read it over and over on boat building forums.

Same thing happened to me. Our original arrangement was my customers got a discount and then I got a small % of any sales to my customers. Was usually enough to get me about 3 gallons of epoxy a year. Not big cut of the sales. More of a courtesy for directing folks his way.

Then it turned into my customers getting a smaller discount and me getting nothing. Again, not a big deal.

Then it turned into nobody getting any discount. And if that's how RAKA has to do it, so be it. What ticked me off is I never got any word of this. I tell my customers "Call Larry.... he'll hook you up!".

They'd call and Larry would refuse. So I had to hear about policy changes via my dissatisfied customers.

RAKA, Larry, or somebody could have at least had the courtesy and professionalism to let me know.

They still have a decent product and I haven't heard any complaint from customers... besides when my discount program got cut off.

But I won't buy my supplies from them any more because of that. That's a personal choice. Professionally, I say they provide a decent product at a good price.

I hope that makes sense.

 

[bearridge]

Makes dang good sense.

 

[redfisher]

I love the fact that I can order from Raka at lunch time on Monday and my order is at my door on Tuesday afternoon. Yeah,they're close.

 

[hairymick]

I use and recommend only West Systems, specifically, 105 resin and 207 special purpose hardener,

They might be a little dearer than some but the product is absolutely first rate and is way superior in every way to anything else I have used.

They are also seriously good people to do business with. They know their stuff, are passionate about their product and are very happy to help out with technical advice on it.

For me to use another brand epoxy now would be akin to my building a paddlecraft other than one of Matt's or Uncle John's - IT JUST AINT GONNA HAPPEN.

 

[BEARS BUDDY]

And Mick, it was developed by a former neighbor (Jan Gougeon) and his brothers here in Bay City.

 

[Geezer]

Howdy! I've been lurking and reading up on all your wisdom here for a time and I've finally started my UJ pirogue. It's going great so far. I got my stuff from Raka and they were really helpful. They gave me all kinds of advice without me having to even ask. I wanted to let you know someting about Raka which might affect the digruntlement some feel about their discontinued discounts. They got ripped off to the tune of over 50k by a former employee so I think that they are having to tighten up to cover that.

 

[hairymick]

G'day Geezer!!

Welcome aboard mate, and congratulations on our choice of a fine boat indeed.

I have heard some very good things about RAKA products but don't have access to them this side of the drain.

Please share with us your build adventures mate.

 

[Geezer]

Thanks Mick! I'm actually building two at the same time - His 'n Hers. We have twin boys age 8 and we hope to get the whole family out on them this summer so I've got to bear down! I plan 15' 6" with the fourth rib. I'm using 3mm ply. The guy at Raka suggested an alternative to the scarfing described by UJ. Essentially the same, but not sloped-- a straight tongue 1/3 of the original thickness. Overlap them with epoxy putty filling and voila! Using a radial arm saw made the technique quite easy.

 

[hairymick]

Good idea!

I would suggest a small butt block over the seam on the inside, just to re-inforce the join. A piece of your ply about 2" wide and the width of your panel would make the join a whole lot stronger.

I have been playing with a UJ at my work for a couple of years now (whenever we get some spare time) and keep coming up with ideas on how the job might be done a little easier or better or stronger. Not that the boat really needs it. but at some time, I plan to build something very similar for myself.

Your missus and kids will love these boats. Expect a couple of orders from the littleuns for their own little pirogues. 8)

 

[Geezer]

I'm planning on glassing both sides and with the fourth rib I was hoping that I wouldn't have to add the butt blocks. I put too much epoxy in the joints and they aren't as flat as they should have been, but they sure seem solid. If I can't sand them well enough, I'll give up the natural look and fair and paint. The bottom pieces turned out better. The other departure which may or may not turn out to be a good idea is that I am using single 16' closet bar with a deep groove cut in them for the rubrails. The plan is to drop them right over the top of the side . I have to cut a notch to get around the stems which is a little tricky and I still can't visualize how they will join. Too many compound angles for my tiny brain. I got one done tonight. Seven to go...

 

[Geezer]

Well Mick, I'm laughing my butt blocks off! I was too much the artiste when I doubted the butt block suggestion! I snapped a panel in half moving it! Better now than later though! So today I'm installing 6" wide butt blocks with 1/4 inch Luan and I'm grateful for the advice which needless to say I won't ever second guess again! I had contemplated glassing the insides before assembly for the convenience factor but I saw that another one of the site's experts recommended wood to wood and I may be dumb, but, I aint so dumb as to tempt fate again! I do plan to flow coat all panels before assembly unless somebody tells me different. Thanks, you all!
GUY

 

[Kayak Jack]

Geezer,

Your experience mirros mine. Butt blocks are a simple, proven method of joining plywood panels. I chamfer the edges of my blocks at about 45 degrees so fiberglass will go over it easier.